"person centred"... a way of thinking, a way of life. An opportunity to discuss.

[robw]

The Original thread is about a link to a readily available tool, that some individuals may find may find helpful in understanding themselves or those that they care about a little better. Unlike most diagnostic tools it is easy to use and available to anyone with access to the internet – which I feel gives at least the possibility for an individual to have control and ownership of their condition. Surely control and ownership are person centred.

The tool does not and I have not, professed it to be in anyway a substitute for a formal diagnosis. It also does not, nor have I eluded to a predilection to any particular model of support. For the record I'm more than a fan of a “person centred” way of thinking, which by virtue cannot be prescribed. A discussion around a person centred approach should belong in it's own thread. Maybe one should be started.

Well as this is such an important issue and I suggested the new thread, here it is.

Please feel free to discuss issues around a person centred approach and ways of thinking. These might include but do not have to be exclusively be:
- person centred nomenclature
- person centred understanding of the spectrum
- person centred thinking
- person centred styles of support
- is diagnosis person centred, if not can it be?

What are your thoughts, experiences and feelings on this matter? Let us share our ideas.

[robw]

We appear to have wandered off thread once more. Nevertheless lets appraise what has been added.

Gubn wrote:

This is not the first organisation or person(s) who can put a shop window display on, how many times have I heard people say "Radical, I like radical" and then shut down. An interesting observation and perspective. We might ask what your “shop window display” tells us about what you have to offer?
You say you got a real solution.... We'd all love to see the plan. You ask me for a contribution..... We're all doing what we can. - John Lennon, 1968. Some of us come here, and some of us claim to come here, for a sense of community. A chance to talk, a chance share ideas and though this sharing, a chance to learn; both as an individual and as a collective. I'm sure someone once said that communication is social glue.
All I know is there are few singular truths, but...
...the more I know the less I understand... -Don Henley, 1988. ....is definitely one of them. I try to take inspiration where ever I find it and never give up trying to understand things, little by little, better than I did yesterday.


How shall I play!
Can't you talk?
How shall I talk!
Can't you listen to us?
How shall I listen to you!
Will you try?
Yes, I will try, but teach me how to try. - Tito Rajarshi MukhopadhyayGubn wrote:

Person centred is not a discussion it is a way of life. Robw wrote:
Person centred... a way of thinking, a way of lifeI am glad we agree on the important things. Common ground for discussion is where communities start.

Gubn wrote:

prehaps you should promote a disscusion based on reflection not theories. Professionals hide behind all this. I'm all for discussion so long as there is a purpose to the discussion. “True” learning however is a never ending cycle. Otherwise our lives become ruled by rhetoric and dogma. I'm no expert on this process, (if there are experts out there that can help me on this point, please do), but for me it works like this:
At the start, we get an idea (organic or otherwise). Then we try an idea out, or test it. Reflect, do the results from trying this idea out provide us with evidence that supports the idea? If “no”, maybe it was a bad idea, start again. If “yes” a theory is created. Use the theory to understand life and the world in which we live, just a little better. But that's not the end in itself – it's just new beginning if a different but linked cycle. We should then look for new evidence based on our new understanding. Once more,reflection. Can the theory be modified to account for the new evidence? If “no” then we have a “revolution of thought” and must begin the process from the start again. However if “yes” the theory has been improved and we go back to looking for new evidence.

If we simply get an idea and ignore all other ideas and contradictory evidence, thus keeping that idea forever, then our thoughts reach the dead end we call these thoughts dogmatic.

Reflection is part of the process. Indeed an important part of the process, but only a part of the learning process. If reflection becomes all we do the are we not always going to find ourselves backwards facing? It's easy to believe in the seductive satisfaction of truth that hindsight gives us, because
...hindsight by it's nature is always going to be 20/20” Dr. D A Chalton. 2009. (Or 6/6 depending on whether you want to take an American or a European perspective on the matter). If all we do is look at reflections is there not a chance of being accused of being narcissistic?

Indeed if all we do is look for the theories then we risk losing the humanity in that which we seek and everything just becomes an academic or rhetorical exercise.


Gubn wrote:

It's still how my practice and approaches have helped this poor disabled person and I am so wonderful because I champion person centred thinking. An interesting and informative take on your own practice or perspective. Thanks for sharing it with us. May I ask you to reflect on the effect that describing people this way has on their future chances? Also I might suggest that you reflect on your own differences and difficulties and try to imagine not being respected or supported in a way that helped you live with or overcome these. We are all either enabled or disabled, NOT by our condition, but by our environments our opportunities, the respect understanding and support we receive from others. This makes perfect sense to me, as someone who needed support as a younger person to overcome my own personal differences and difficulties with communication. Ultimately, learning to live with those differences that “just are”, has been an important part of who I was, who I am and no doubt who will become.


Gubn wrote:

Have you ever though "Everyone should have a person centred plan"? Then that thinking is not person centred.Robw wrote:

.....a “person centred” way of thinking, which by virtue cannot be prescribed.I see common ground once more. It looks like we might just be getting better at this. This fills my heart with a little hope.

[forumAdmin]

it is interesting that you agree so much yet cannot seem to interact in a way that fosters other members joining in. If all responses to an opinion are negative critical etc then people do not want to join in.


robw - when quoting others posts please use the format you used at the top of this thread, This means there it an arrow which will link to the original post to be seen in its original context.

Please rectify this asap

[snakes77]

I have been supporting people for more years then I care to mention and I have always strived to work in a personal centered approach to all people that I have worked with.

It has never been question to me about whether this is a way of life but the way I live my life.

I have learnt so much over the years from others that may have shared my views and those who may not share them.

This has helped reinforce my work practices, shape my views and beliefs over the years.

I would like to mention that sometimes we find our selves in environments were these views are not shared, with colleges or other professionals and you can find it hard to challenge these, due to lack of experiences, knowledge or even the feeling of isolation, as your views may be totally opposite to those around you.

I am also aware of place’s were there mission statements and ethos’s are that of always ensuring that they have these approaches and the fact is they do not, this is not to say that they have lied or attempted to mislead but that they really don’t understand what it means and how this is achieved.

If we don’t discuss and challenge others then how can we learn and also shape others to understand that personal centre approaches do work and how to make them work.

I feel that a lot can be learnt by us all who work with people and share there successes and also were it might fail and the constraints of our working environments that may prevent us from having a fully Personal centered approach to our work and how this can be changed.

In a perfect world I do agree we shouldn’t have to have these discussions as it should just be so, but unfortunately we don’t and it is still people like our selves that fight and want others to understand that we should be having to discus this and helping to challenge people’s views and practices.

A question to GUBN you have stated that it is a way of life and that you do this as a matter of course, could you share for those who may strive to understand this “way of life” an example of how this way of life can help those people we support? An example of how this is achieved? And why people should believe in this approach and make it there “way of life”?

Also robw would you care to comment on these questions also?

And anybody else that would care to comment on the questions I have asked.

I look forward for a proper discussion and that people can share there views on this.

[snakes77]

I do apologise I didn't mean to offend you by using a abbreviation of you user name, as you can see this is the first time I have posted on this forum and I was just following the previous post.

[snakes77]

Has no one got any think to add regarding this subject I find it very strange that at at the beginning of this discussion people was very passionate about there beliefs, but then when a serious question was asked no one has felt the need to commented back regarding my questions.:confused:

I would like to think this is due to people not having time to comment back rather then being ignored.

[inciree09]

Hello again,I have nearly finished collecting responses to my survey. Thank you very much to everyone who has taken part so far.If you would like to complete my survey and have not done so already please click on the link above.I will post a link to my results here when I have them.Rosie

[Hans]

Hello all

My thoughts on this perspective is that we need to consider what is our theory on life and what we strive for and what is the reality. I will try to explain.

I thin k myself as being a person that meets everyone I meet with open mind and categorising them to be a unique person. I also think that generally I rely that my actions towards another person is based on this background. But I also admit, that sometimes I don´t care about other people. Sometimes I am extremely selffish an often can mock over little things in other persons. Mostly I try to that at home in front of the television so that I can have my fully personcentered attention when I meet reel people and not persons in the telly.

But this shift of being able to think personcenteres and not is what I think we all do. And therefore a think that the personcentered way is a way of thinking because the way of living, as far as i am concerned, is not possible.

But the difference can be, that when I go to work I know that I have to think different because otherwise I couldn´t do my work as I want to and as the person i support whants to. FDoes that make me false or twofaced? I don´t think so. It just makes it clear that I know what is right but also, for me to survive, I have to have my space.

I think that many people who support other poeple aren´t aware of this difference and therefore strives to be the same over all. And taht is impossible. But my concerns goes to the parents and siblings to the people I support. They can not like I do switch on and off. So where is their space or their time when they can be selfcentered and not personcentered on their children or sibling.

To snakes 77. I have had a lot of young person with autism and/or ADHD telling me that the biggest difference in thier life, was when they met me, because they experienced that i wouldn´t change them, but respected them as they were and tried to give them information on what they needed instead of pushing or pulling them on to a fit point. I don´t want to tell this to glorify myself, but you asked for examples and I think the best examples should come from the people we support.

I don´t know whether I have taken this discusion to another place than thought or have offended somebody. And if i have I will apologise for that. Is was not my attention. What I wanted was to share my thoughts on this behalf and respect that other have different thoughts. It is actually what makes the worls interesting, that we don´t agree on everything, bur can discuss certain points of all aspects, end thereby learn or experience more.

Hans